Curse

I Jonas I · Jul 10, 2009, 05:09 AM // 05:09

So I've seen quite a few top guilds running the mindblast distortion crap at stand. My question: Why? They don't snare, they don't pressure, they don't cause disruption, they have no melee shutdown, I just do not understand it.

They don't pressure as well as a diversion mesmer would at stand and, considering that all they do is cast fire magic spells, I am guessing that pressure is what they are aimed at creating. But why run the bar if a lot of other bars can pressure better than it can?

Obviously the mind blast template has more splitability than most of your other options, but is that splitability really needed? you can already counter a one man split with your ranger or your flagger, so I really don't see how it is beneficial in that regard, either.

Sun Fired Blank · Jul 10, 2009, 05:29 AM // 05:29

Would you run a Cruel Spear Paragon at stand? Now what if the paragon didn't require line of sight, was immune to anti-physical nonsense, gave you a completely different damage type, had 75% blocking and a reasonably decent self-heal, pumps the same DPS regardless of adrenaline, and could split if required?

It's kind of shitty logic but that's the kind of the logic that goes into playing your E/Me at stand.

lutz · Jul 10, 2009, 05:39 AM // 05:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sun Fired Blank

Would you run a Cruel Spear Paragon at stand? Now what if the paragon didn't require line of sight, was immune to anti-physical nonsense, gave you a completely different damage type, had 75% blocking and a reasonably decent self-heal, pumps the same DPS regardless of adrenaline, and could split if required?

It's kind of shitty logic but that's the kind of the logic that goes into playing your E/Me at stand.

Except Cruel Spear Paragons actually do more damage.

Improvavel · Jul 10, 2009, 06:00 AM // 06:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by lutz

Except Cruel Spear Paragons actually do more damage.

Not that much more vs lvl 20 with normal armor players.

And it is a different type of damage requiring a completely different set of counters.

And Mind blast eles cause disruption - Meteor.

GinsuNinjutsu · Jul 10, 2009, 06:36 AM // 06:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Improvavel

And Mind blast eles cause disruption - Meteor.

http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Disrupting_Throw

You just got tomahawked · Jul 10, 2009, 08:01 AM // 08:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by GinsuNinjutsu

http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Disrupting_Throw

Everyone runs Disrupting Throw.

Massive Impulsa · Jul 10, 2009, 10:29 AM // 10:29

Rodgorts is prty strng 8v8, and it pressures quite well.

They also have a strong split ability, and is pretty hard to kill.

Improvavel · Jul 10, 2009, 10:51 AM // 10:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by GinsuNinjutsu

http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Disrupting_Throw

I wasn't saying paragons can't disrupt - I was answering the OP - he says that MB eles have no disruption.

Anyway, Paras will most likely use Cry of Frustration for disruption.

I just hope you aren't trying to tell me Paragons can also split, because that is one of the reasons they aren't solid in GvG.

FoxBat · Jul 10, 2009, 02:48 PM // 14:48

MBs own guild lords and they are hard to kill. They function OKish at the stand, but that isn't the reason you bring one.

Ec]-[oMaN · Jul 10, 2009, 02:51 PM // 14:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jonas The Keen

They don't pressure as well as a diversion mesmer would at stand and, considering that all they do is cast fire magic spells, I am guessing that pressure is what they are aimed at creating. But why run the bar if a lot of other bars can pressure better than it can?

Except the Mindblast is a template that causes pressure through direct dmg, degen, spam-ability. It amplifies whatever else is in the build for sort of a more overload. While as a Dom mesmer causes pressure through shutdown and all your other characters need to make that pressure or else the shutdown provided by the dom mesmer does very little. Remember playing a MindBlast requires no twitch interrupts to cause pressure, very little communication at stand, whereas a dom mes takes a whole lot more effort/skill to warrant the slot.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jonas The Keen

Obviously the mind blast template has more splitability than most of your other options, but is that splitability really needed? you can already counter a one man split with your ranger or your flagger, so I really don't see how it is beneficial in that regard, either.

It isn't so much about countering or playing defensively with it, it allows you the option to play offensively too, you can cause solo Lord dmg which is what the game is more about now, and you also have more direct dmg to kill other splits as well.

Helix Dreadlock · Jul 10, 2009, 03:36 PM // 15:36

Burn it ALL!

FIRE!

yes, it causes a lot of pressure, because of a constant -7 degen.
Use searing flames, and that's AoE 7 seconds of -7 degen, considering it lasts for a while, it does a shitload of dmg.

Iotan · Jul 10, 2009, 07:38 PM // 19:38

MB eles are great for maintaining pressure. Poison spam from ranger plus fire damage from the ele will normally get eaten up by the Rit party heals but if he's not at the stand then the pressure can be overwhelming. Mind blast will roll a monk on low energy whereas a dom mesmer (on his own) can't do much in that situation. And most mesmers get the shit kicked out of them regularly anyway.

Also, a dom mesmer doesn't do any pressure when he's not targeting the opposing monks. He's just relieving pressure from your team (which an ele can do with Meteor/linebacking.)

*lemming* · Jul 10, 2009, 08:06 PM // 20:06

You can't put support skills on a mindblast. You can't split a paragon off if 8v8 isn't working.

I Angra I · Jul 11, 2009, 11:15 AM // 11:15

decent pressure, decent spike damage, hard to kill, can split..

.. and if all else fails, will win you the game at 28

it's there because it's versatile and allows you to play for 28 if nothing else is working

Reverend Dr · Jul 11, 2009, 10:08 PM // 22:08

If your Mindblast split is damaging the lord then awesome you are going to win at 28.

If the Mindblast split can't damage the lord then your stand team is going to have to push and wipe their stand team.

If both splits are at a standstill or your team is losing on one, you need to do something different. Just about the only options involve putting MB's at the stand. Its all about context of the match.

Yue · Jul 12, 2009, 02:23 AM // 02:23

A MB will punish the other team for trying to bodyblock your flagger or moving through a choke. A paragon won't.

Div · Jul 12, 2009, 04:45 PM // 16:45

Mind blast isn't the best damage/pressure template out there for pure stand fights, but it has a lot more versatility in that if you lose the stand fight, you can still split it off and try to gain an advantage.

You can counter a mind blast splitting with a flagger, but then the rest of your team should be able to beat theirs 7v7. In most situations, I'd easily trade my mind blast for your flagger. If you are taking pressure, trading a mind blast for a ranger is another amazing trade.

Morgan Crowe · Jul 14, 2009, 09:57 AM // 09:57

It's pretty funny that you think a MB doesn't pressure. Due to fast target switching, damage below spirit bond and burning it's totally insane.

And as already mentioned if you're going to lose the 8v8 you can still split him off and if the opponent sends the flagger back to base, they are going to die in mainteam. Pretty simple, effective and boring at the same time.

ballinshiznick · Aug 05, 2009, 08:31 PM // 20:31

its for dps lol.

Eddie Frenzy Spam · Aug 07, 2009, 01:57 AM // 01:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Helix Dreadlock

yes, it causes a lot of pressure, because of a constant -7 degen.
Use searing flames, and that's AoE 7 seconds of -7 degen, considering it lasts for a while, it does a shitload of dmg.

What are you talking about...

In response to the OP, read the above posters, they've pretty much summed it up.